Deja Vu: Here We Go Again Bargaining With Terrorists
Published November 25, 2009The Single Greatest Threat to Israel
It’s not demographics, it’s no secular vs haredi issues, it ain’t even Iran. The greatest threat Israel faces is the perpetual watering down of the country’s principles. I’m talking of course about Gilad Shalit, who’s been rotting away as a Hamas captive for 3+ years. Do we want him back? Don’t you know it.
The question becomes is it Gilad Shalit being held hostage now or the State of Israel?
Arguably it is both. We’ve taken ourselves hostage by negotiating with terrorists & worse, giving in to their outrageous demands. After Lebanon War II, every western nation & even the UN stated matter of factly that Israel’s soldiers (including Shalit) must be released unconditionally.. That morphed into releasing a cold blooded child murdering terrorist & an undisclosed numbers of other terrorists in return for a few mutilated body parts. The Lebanese declared it a national holiday after robbing us blind & I watched in horror as the exchange took place live on Israeli TV.
The reaction in Israel was less than boisterous. The whole thing was media pumped to no end, ‘we must do this’ the media said endlessly just as they do now. No, in fact we mustn’t do this. As much as I empathize with the Shalit family, and did so with Regev & Goldwasser’s families – They are manipulating Israel & using media as a bludgeon on our better sensibilities.
After the last few exchanges the consensus was these were a mistake, no kidding? Ya Think? Israel set up a commission who’s findings are not being officially released, but the recommendation after these fiascos was all future swaps be 1 for 1 – Period. Here’s the tally, it’s not not pretty.
- June 2008: In exchange for the bodies of two Israeli soldiers, Israel frees a Lebanese convicted in a fatal 1979 apartment house attack, four other Lebanese prisoners, an undisclosed number of Palestinian prisoners and dozens of bodies of Lebanese Hezbollah guerrillas.
- January 2004: In a deal with Hezbollah, Israel trades 436 Arab prisoners and the bodies of 59 Lebanese fighters for an Israeli civilian and the bodies of three Israeli soldiers.
- July 1996: Israel frees 65 prisoners for the return of the bodies of two soldiers from Lebanon.
- September 1991: Israel frees 51 prisoners for proof that one of its soldiers held in Lebanon is dead.
- May 1985: Israel swaps 1,150 Lebanese and Palestinian prisoners for three Israeli soldiers captured in Lebanon after Israel invaded in 1982. Criticism over the lopsided deal intensified after many of the freed prisoners played leading roles in a Palestinian uprising that began in 1987.
- November 1983: Israel swaps 4,600 Palestinian and Lebanese prisoners for six Israeli soldiers captured in Lebanon in September 1982.
Now, a thousand-plus more are to be released, despite these statements regarding who’s on the Hamas list..
According to Israeli security officials, the 450 prisoners included senior terrorist engineers who planned and carried out “the most murderous terrorist attacks that the State of Israel has ever known.” Releasing and returning them to the West Bank and Gaza would severely endanger Israeli civilians.
I’ll say it
Because not many people in Israel will outloud despite their agreement. The price is too high. The People & State of Israel cannot be held hostage for one man irrespective of who he is or what the circumstances are. Not even for 10 men, or 100 for that matter. There are 7 million people here, we take combat losses, we lose civilians to terror, we lose 20+ people a week to bad drivers. Israel is a dangerous place, we are only making it ever more dangerous with this insanity.
I thought it was Barak responsible in earlier exchanges. Then I blamed Olmert, now I blame Bibi who just lost my vote. If the PM can’t make the hard decisions he should resign. Sacrificing the State of Israel for one man, whomever he may be, is against every Zionist (not too mention Jewish law) principle.
I do not support negotiating with terrorists
I most certainly do not support releasing them from prison - No matter what.
I support killing them, nothing less, nothing more. If the goal is to lose more lives (which this deal will certainly accomplish) then send in Commandos. Some will die, Shalit too probably but they will do so with gusto defending the State as they are combat soldiers rescuing one of their own.
It is preferable than releasing hundreds of terrorists who will murder & maim countless Israeli civilians. At least then we’ll still have our honor, because only a fool makes a deal with the Devil - But it takes a nation of morons to keep on making the same bad deal over & over again.
‘It’s the right thing to do, the moral thing to do’..
No, I’m sorry, it most certainly is not.
8 CommentsThe Mofaz Plan: Fox Loose in Livni’s Kadima Hen House (Link Update)
Published November 10, 2009Mofaz tables Disengagement+ in bid to top Livni
The internal battle for the Kadima leadership rolls on. Shaul Mofaz the party #2 seized an opportune moment (all Israeli political heavy weights abroad) to let loose a bombshell as part of his leadership bid, a new peace plan.. To recognize a Palestinian State!
[...] Under the plan, Israel would annex settlement blocs while withdrawing from 60 percent of the West Bank, comprising Areas A and B, where 99.2 of the Palestinians live, and additional land to create territorial contiguity. A Palestinian state would be set up in those areas of the West Bank and in Gaza, while no settlements would be evacuated at that stage.
Israel would then negotiate the fate of the rest of the West Bank and other core issues of the conflict with the leadership of the new Palestinian state, while passing legislation sanctioning compensation for settlers living in outlying settlements that would be evacuated.
“As a candidate to lead the country, I felt I had to present a plan” – Mofaz. [...]
Mofaz’s plan is very different than Livni’s Annapolis process, in which Israel would make no concessions to the Palestinians until a final-status deal would be reached on all issues. Bypassing Livni on the left, Mofaz said he would be willing to negotiate with Hamas under certain conditions to advance the plan.
“If Hamas would be elected and would want to negotiate and accept the quartet’s conditions, from that moment, it is no longer Hamas,” Mofaz said. “Responsible leadership in Israel would sit with those who changed their agenda.” [...]
Please everyone but Israel plan..
Shaul Mofaz goes gunning for Livni
Not quite sure what if any benefit would arise from Mofaz’s plan. We already tried the disengagement plan in Gaza with poor results. This time out Mofaz seems convinced the entity leading this proposed Palestinian state may be Hamas from the get go, yet he’s undeterred. Isn’t the objective supposed to be gaining some peace? It seems highly unlikely any deal would result from this disengagement+ plan, we’d be in the same spot we are in now less the land and with 10x the security threat.
Equally, this doesn’t assist us in any way securing a regional peace deal with the Arab world. Sorta looks like a plan full of rewards for all the wrong people (including terrorists) with little payoff for Israel. Mofaz is clearly gambling he can rely on his solid right military credentials.. While leaping way left, poaching at Livni’s support base in the mix of Labor, Kadima, Meretz liberal soup that exists.
Time will tell how solid that keeps his right flank in Kadima & beyond. The center party is comprised of both right & left after all. Is this electable? Olmert certainly tried, but witness the backlash in Israel with the resurgent right as a result.
Not that it matters much – Hamas responds..
Former Palestinian Authority foreign minister Mahmoud Zahar of Hamas responded that it would never accept the Quartet’s conditions, which include recognizing Israel, disarming terrorists, and accepting diplomatic deals signed by the PA.
“Hamas will not negotiate with Israel,” said Hamas spokesman Fawzi Barhoum. “We do not believe in engaging with the occupation, or in talks that would beautify its face in the eyes of the world.” [...]
Mofaz is gunning for Livni
Shaul is sure to get much more headway with his plan internally within Kadima. He upstages Livni who’s leadership qualities are being weekly challenged within the party, he even tosses in the fact Ehud Barak & President Peres support the initiative. All subtle jabs at Tzipi. Her personal relationship with Barak is frosty at best, and her own plan beyond opposing Netanayhu in everything remains obscured. The strategy of undermining her here is already paying off..
Kadima warms to Mofaz plan for Hamas talks, despite Livni opposition (Haaretz)
Kadima chairwoman Tzipi Livni on Tuesday slammed party rival Shaul Mofaz’ plan to open negotiations with Hamas in order to push forth the establishment of a Palestinian state, saying the concept ran contrary to their faction’s political platform.
While Livni would prefer to ignore the initiative of her number 2, however, she will not be able to avoid the issue for very long, as Kadima MKs are demanding a serious discussion. [...]
A number of Kadima MKs, some of whom supported Livni in her primary fight against Mofaz, support discussing his proposal. [...]
Not Ready for Prime Time
All in all it doesn’t look like Mofaz’s plan will gain much traction in the wider Israel arena, it’s too far left for the climate, not too mention dreamy in regards to Hamas. But I’m not sure it was designed for that purpose. With Bibi, Lieberman, Barak, Livni all clamoring at the top for the leadership of Israel stakes, it is a bit crowded up there right now.
Mofaz has other things to worry about, he’s got to knock Livni out of the Kadima leadership perch before he can play on their turf. His plan looks like the latest in a series of ever more forceful branch shakes.
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Link Update: Mofaz taking heat & clarifying his Hamas statements (Jpost)
“I was the one who fought Hamas through the crosshairs of an Apache [assault helicopter], I stood behind the assassinations of [Sheikh Ahmed] Yassin and [Abdel Aziz] Rantisi and did everything I could to halt the suicide-bombers’ terror from Judea and Samaria during Operation Defensive Shield, and was in charge of the ongoing hits on top Hamas figures between 2003-2005 in Gaza. Nobody can doubt what I think about Hamas.”
1 CommentWater Levy: Kadima Opts for Irresponsible Populism; Endangers Nation
Published November 5, 2009Could Dalia Itzik & Tzipi Livni be MORE Out of Touch? Doubtful.
This week Kadima made a grand affair of repealing the Drought Levy going into effect this month. Personally I can’t believe it. Israel’s Kinneret water source is a full 5 meters below its waterline.
It is hovering at a critical level - Meaning any further water tap below these levels can permanently damage the entire source. In Israel they are already talking about a dead lake soon (meaning not enough water to sustain the Lake’s balance which can lead to oxygen depletion & the death of all the fish & wildlife) not too mention the depletion of our fresh water source.
Aquifers Also Tapped Out
The same can be said for Israel’s natural below ground aquifers, they are in danger of permanent damage from salination due to excess pumping. Israel is in a severe drought and it will take a few years to build desalinization capacity to equal current consumption. Thankfully, the water levy encourages conservation in the mean time until that can happen. And let’s be clear, without a lowering of consumption the forecast is that turning on the faucet will soon result in NO WATER COMING OUT!
Drought Levy
Under the levy now in effect as of November, every household member is allocated a certain monthly amount of water, which incidentally is quite cheap overall and sufficient. Excessive use beyond the allocation is charged at a higher level, pretty reasonable stuff considering the national challenge.
Bonus, since the plan was announced a dramatic lowering of consumption has resulted – During the peak summer months yet! Clearly, when faced with a levy for excess use people perk up & pay attention, water consumption goes down. This isn’t rocket science, nor is the levy unmanageable fiscally by any stretch.
Populists
Kadima’s press conference this week complete with signage & catch phrases was the latest irresponsible play by the party. They are calling it the water tax & want it repealed. Do they have alternatives to suggest? Not really. Are they being irresponsible in the extreme? Most certainly, and what’s the payoff? Sheer Populism. Livni stripped of her titles, Dalia Itzik stripped of her Knesset speaker’s chair are both rather desperate it seems to gain cheap political points any way they can in a most pitiful manner.
Mofaz, Livni & Itzik take political opportunism to new heights while reaching for new lows - Water table included.
Kadima in Opposition.. With the World.
At a time when the whole world has moved to reduced largess, conservation where possible, sustainable development and due to economics an effort toward some minimalism & enhanced personal responsibility - Kadima bucks the trend. The ‘drought tax’ according to Kadima is get this a ”violent, unjust tax”.
If Kadima thinks that’s violence, wait till they see how people react when they don’t have any water in their taps. We need to conserve, many Israelis are sadly oblivious & I see copious water wastage often enough. Ok so some people are pigs, c’est la vie – No problem, let them pay to fill up the trough.
Link: Haaretz of all places savages Dalia Itzik, Livni & Kadima over this frankly absurd play..
Who can blame them? This is without a doubt the dumbest idea to pour out of Kadima in a while and there have been a few. Livni is proving to be a terrible leader & in lowly opposition yet. What a disaster if she were the Prime Minister of Israel, it is as simple as that. The Kadima motion will go before the Knesset to repeal the already voted on & passed water levy bill – That’s how stupid this is..
Lion of Zion: War Fighter Ashkenazi Draws Iranian Line in German Sand
Published October 29, 2009Shocka! There appears to be “Daylight” between America & Israel on Iran
IDF Chief of Staff Ashkenazi was in Germany this week speaking at a Holocaust remembrance memorial, he gave an inspired speech. There are a number of reasons to examine the text;
- Ashkenazi as head of the IDF is probably the 3rd most powerful man in Israel.
- Ashkenazi is intensely popular, trusted & respected by an Israeli public which will support his judgment.
- Ashkenazi is intensely popular, trusted & respected by an IDF which will also support his judgment.
After reforming the IDF and coming off of what is widely regarded as a successful military regional war in Gaza, no one has more solid support in Israel today than Ashkenazi. On military matters he is even more trusted than the Defense Minister Ehud Barack, to which can be added the public’s respect for him which rivals that of Benjamin Netanyahu. In Israel, such superheros cut across post-partisan lines and appeal across the strata on a much more emotional level - As the no-nonsense General, defender of Israel.
Chief of Staff General Ashkenazi in Germany has words for Israel's enemies. (Photo: IDF Press Office)
Poignant, not so veiled words
Ashkenazi fills the top General role and void left by the legendary Ariel Sharon himself. This status in Israel, and the sharp words in his German speech make for a heady mix..
“We will never look lightly upon those who scheme our demise, we will not deposit our security in the hands of foreigners and we will allow no one to control the future of the State of Israel,” he said during a ceremony held at the ill-famed Platform 17 in Berlin, from which many Jews left for concentration camps.
“Out of the silent steel plates on this platform rise the screams of our Jewish brothers, who were marched into the train cars, beaten and humiliated. Their screams echo until this very moment and they are the screams of Israel’s obligation and my own, as the man who stands at the head of its army. It is our obligation to remember forever the most horrible tragedy in the history of mankind,” Ashkenazi said [...]
Not pulling punches.. in contrast to President Obama
Ashkenazi went to add that Anti-Semitism and this threat continues to this day alluding to Iran, and that Israel would assert itself in its own defense. He has been fairly clear until now and apparently going forward as well – His is the hawkish view in regards to preventing Iran from obtaining nuclear weapons. It is a view which stands in contrast to the Obama administration, which for all intents & purposes seems to have given up on stopping Iran.
Analysis: US making plans for Iran nuke strategy
WASHINGTON – The Obama administration is quietly laying the groundwork for long-range strategy that could be used to contain a nuclear-equipped Iran and deter its leaders from using atomic weapons.
U.S. officials insist they are not resigned to a nuclear Iran and are pressing negotiations to prevent it from joining the world’s nuclear club. But at the same time, the administration has set in place the building blocks of policies to contend with an Iran armed with atomic weapons.
Those elements, former officials and analysts said, include the newly revised defense shield for Europe and deeper defense ties to Gulf states that feel threatened by Iran.
Daylight? Looks more like High-Noon.
The Obama administration may be resigned to apparent surrender on a nuclear Iran, but the Israeli position seems continuously clear. Netanyahu the PM is clear, Barak the Defense Minister is clear, Ashkenazi the top man in uniform is clear.. Together with the heads of Israel’s intelligence these three men will be the arbiters of judgment in regards to Iranian issues.
All options remain on the table.
5 CommentsFor the Win: ‘Pro-Israel’ J Street Feeling the Pain (Link Update)
Published October 22, 2009Newsflash: Criticism is par for the course when you are “Pro-Israel” – pseudo or not so get used to it.
What a week for the far left progressive democratic organization posing as a Pro-Israel lobby. The group has finally arrived, from obscurity to irrelevance that is.
Instead of furthering the J Street Agenda their upcoming conference has effectively pulled back the shades. Is suspect the lead up to the event has been even better than the conference! In sum, what has been confirmed is what many of us involved already knew.
This outfit is a pro-Obama far left organ that relies mostly on distortion to achieve its aims. It’s got very little to do with being Pro-Israel. Here in Israel the views it lobbies for (to the left of the Meretz party yet!) are not supported by Israelis, we’re talking not even 5%.
By default, this should make them totally irrelevant. Far be it for me to criticize American Jews, though as a product of both North America & Israel I do so liberally.. But one has to ask oneself. If you are pushing views as a concerned pro-Israel Jew in the diaspora, shouldn’t these views at least mesh up with say someone somewhere ACTUALLY in Israel? Not even the majority, but say a minimum 5% threshold? So far that is simply not the case.
Supporting Israel does not mean telling it or its electorate what to do, that’s called undermining Israel.
Frankly, the fact that J Street views have near zero representation here makes the whole thing rather insulting to us Israelis. Worse, the outfits make up is mostly composed of former Olso Israeli rejects, people actively booted out of Israeli politics because they have near zero support here. They picked up & setup shop in America instead, where the money & ignorance hopefully flow.. (Mrs. Avital neglects to mention in that Op Ed piece she’s an adviser / affiliated with J Street – because this is their modus operandi – Distortion)
Sadly, Obama made a similar mistake when he figured he in all his uneducated wisdom knew better than Israelis themselves about Israel or what the country’s policy should be. He was rewarded with the actual statistics – 4% of Israelis agreeing with him & a crisis of confidence from a chief ally. It is no shocker that a front group created by Obama’s biggest far left wing Jewish American supporters to provide cover for unpopular anti-Israel positions, should commit the same cardinal sin - or be rewarded by the WH for that matter..
When you align yourself with Israel’s enemies, when you equate Israel to Hamas, when you try to kneecap the INTL sanctions effort regarding Iran’s nuclear program, you are neither “Pro-Peace” nor “Pro-Israel”. What you are is a member of the most far left fringe in American politics, radicals. So don’t be so surprised when you are called out as such. These are the facts.
All credit to Daled Amos, Soccerdad & doubly especially Goldfarb at the Standard for these & many other links, and a fantastically amusing / enlightening week. Many links above in the text have further detailed sourcing which tell the story far better than I can.
J Street's Big Win at the Memeo
This image was shamefully ripped right from the standard blog, but it nicely documents the Big Win!
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UPDATE:
Two more excellent looks at the topic that would be criminal not to link: The Whiner that Roared ; and at Joshuapundit: A Particularly Nasty Dead End.
Obama Prowess: 5 Months of Negotiations; 3 Month Iranian Nuke Delay (Update)
Published October 21, 2009Sorta reminds me of Robert Gibbs’ Job Creation math
Mohamed El-Baradei is finishing up his crowning achievement after providing a decade’s worth of cover for rogue regime illicit nuclear programs. It’s sure to be touted as almost messianic by Obama’s all too eager sycophantic media cheerleaders. Too bad in reality the deal stinks.
The draft agreement between the great powers and Iran celebrated by International Atomic Energy Agency Chief Mohamed ElBaradei is no more than confirmation of the proposal submitted by Iranian representative Saeed Jalili in the first round of talks with the Security Council’s five permanent members and Germany.
The proposal constitutes a clever Iranian move: According to the deal, Tehran will sacrifice roughly 1,400 kilograms (about 3,000 pounds) of the low-grade enriched uranium (that is, 3-5%) produced at its enrichment plant in Natanz in exchange for Western recognition in principle of Iran’s right to enrich uranium on its own soil.
We should also note that we are talking about Iran giving up only 75% of the uranium quantity it already enriched (at least as far as the IAEA knows.) [...]
It was clear that Obama had waffled entirely on this point months ago, and the goal was now to get a deal, any deal – As opposed to stopping the Iranians. Anything to proudly tout as an accomplishment from the WH podium amid endless failures that seemingly all point to the fact that the entire Obama platform is one big bust.
We have learned that this deal has involved direct negotiations between the US & Iran stemming all the way back to June. Which explains why Obama was so non-chalant about propping up the Islamic regime while it was busy murdering & raping Iranian citizens and stealing elections. El Presidente had to be cautious, lest he tip his engagement boat which was already out to sea – Charming!
Smart Power
Doing the negotiation math, we can quickly calculate that this deal has been 5 months in the making from June until now. Sadly, the payoff is not all it is cracked up to be.
This is a modest step forward, at best. “We are buying something like seven to 10 months,” a nameless insider told the Christian Science Monitor. And even that short timeline might be an overstatement.
There are at least 50 cascades of 164 centrifuges each now installed at at the Natanz enrichment facility, although many were still under vacuum in August. According to Alexander Glaser, a single cascade of 164 IR-1 centrifuges could be expected to produce up to 113 kilograms of 3.5% low enriched uranium (LEU) per year. Discount the efficiency of operations somewhat (Geoff Forden suggests 85% based on past performance at Natanz), and Iran could recreate 1,200 kilograms of LEU in a shade over four months using 36 cascades. With 54 cascades going, it would take less than three months.
(HT / Goldfarb)
Wooohoo!
So in return for granting total legitimacy to Iran to continue enriching Uranium. In return for dropping the number one red line set out by the west.. After 5 months of ‘negotiation’ Obama & the western powers are going to help Iran enrich their current stock even higher to 20%, then return the nuclear fuel rods and in the mean Iran will make even more enriched Uranium – Replacing the quantity sold to the west in approximately 3-7 months..
Carry the two, divide by 8.. disregard the exponent & voilà!! Fuzzy math!
That, my friend is worthy of a Peace Prize!
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UPDATE Oct 22: Hello? Where is everybody?
Been sorta scratching my head wondering where official reaction to the draft deal was!? It’s been over 24 hours now and I felt like I was hanging out on a limb. Sometimes this happens in blogging, usually when you screw up big time. I even went back to double check stories on the draft deal in case I missed something.. Because Israel, the blogs & press have been pretty silent.
Never fear, must have just been caution. Barak at the Israeli President’s Conference confirms the major beef with this very very bad deal for Israel:
Barak: Deal could give Iran legitimacy to enrich uranium.
This is now the lead at JPOST, YNET & Haaretz thankfully..
3 Comments
That's me, I'm part of the vast global Zionist Conspiracy you often 'read' about ;)
